FILM IN 140 PANEL SERIES: “FILM PIRACY: DOES IT HELP OR HURT?” Image

Film Threat’s inaugural Film in 140 Panel on Twitter took place on Wednesday, September 29, 2010 from 9-10pm EST. Our first topic was “Film Piracy: Does It Help or Hurt?” The transcript of the panel is below. If you’d like to educate yourself further on the differing opinions on the panel, “Film Piracy: Does It Help or Hurt?”, read below.

PANELISTS

MODERATORS

ANTI-PIRACY ARGUMENT OR CONSIDERATIONS

PRO-PIRACY ARGUMENT OR CONSIDERATIONS

GENERAL PIRACY CONVERSATION

PANEL TRANSCRIPT

Filmin140Panel Welcome to the first Film in 140 Twitter Panel! Our topic tonight is “Film Piracy: Does It Help or Hurt?” #filmin140 -9:00 PM Sep 29th, 2010

LisaViering RT @FilmThreat: 5 minutes to #filmin140 live online panel on film piracy. Follow @Filmin140Panel, instructions to participate here: http://bit.ly/cL5pE8 -9:01 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel Participating is easy: if you have a question for our panelists, use hashtag #filmin140q. Otherwise, just use hashtag #filmin140 -9:01 PM Sep 29th, 2010

WaterholeMovie Now! RT @Filmin140Panel: Welcome 2 the first Film in 140 Twitter Panel! Our topic tonight is “Film Piracy: Does It Help or Hurt?” #filmin140 -9:02 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel You can follow along with the conversation at Film Threat (http://bit.ly/daqlJq) or at TweetChat (http://bit.ly/abFubH) #filmin140 -9:02 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 RT @Filmin140Panel: Welcome to the first Film in 140 Twitter Panel! Our topic tonight is “Film Piracy: Does It Help or Hurt?” #filmin140 -9:02 PM Sep 29th, 2010

KageyNYC Starting now! RT @Filmin140Panel Welcome to 1st Filmin140 Twitter Panel! Our topic 2night is “Film Piracy: Does It Help or Hurt?” #filmin140 -9:03 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms Thanks for inviting me. #filmin140 -9:03 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans Hello #filmin140! Just got here, had a car issue on the way home! -9:03 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel Our moderators this evening are @atlfilm365, @FilmThreat and @shericandler #filmin140 -9:03 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler @jnathanevans welcome Nathan and Ellen! #filmin140 -9:04 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel Our panelists are Ellen Siedler (@fastgirlfilms), filmmaker behind “And Then Came Lola” and Nathan Evans (@jnathanevans)… #filmin140 -9:05 PM Sep 29th, 2010

KageyNYC Hello to all #filmin140 panelists and guests. Popping in to check out the new chat! -9:05 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel Nathan is a filmmaker & he worked on the film “INK.” All introductions aside now, let’s get going. 1st question for panelists… #filmin140 -9:06 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel From @rosspruden: Do you consider piracy as *only* a legal issue or also as a business model issue? #filmin140 -9:08 PM Sep 29th, 2010

dennispeters checking out what’s going at #filmin140 -9:08 PM Sep 29th, 2010

rosspruden Wedding anniversary dinner for me tonight, but showing up for a few minutes. Wouldn’t miss this #filmin140 panel!! 🙂 -9:08 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms I definitely think it’s both. The new online streaming biz model has changed the game. #filmin140 -9:09 PM Sep 29th, 2010

WaterholeMovie Excellent question! RT @Filmin140Panel: @rosspruden: Do you consider piracy as *only* a legal issue or a business model issue? #filmin140 -9:10 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms Your seeing the DVD bootlegging piracy evolve into online streaming (with ads). #filmin140 -9:10 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms Web operators around the world are creating sites, streaming stolen films and making money off ads and/or downloads. #filmin140 -9:11 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans #filmin140 Film piracy is both a legal and business issue for film and all content producers. One that requires evolution. -9:11 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler #filmin140q Do you consider that the film is not the only thing one can make money from? that it is probably the least of revenue #filmin140 -9:12 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans #filmin140 Good point on ads by @fastgirlfilms. Now it’s up to producers to learn the media game and capitalize as well. -9:12 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms Well, learn the “media” game? Our film is available legally online in various ways but hard to compete with “free” #filmin140 -9:13 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans #filmin140 From what I’ve seen work lately, selling a film is one of the smallest rev streams. -9:13 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler @jnathanevans what do you think is the biggest revenue stream? #filmin140 -9:14 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans #filmin140 And of course lots of good analysis there by @rosspruden on how to leverage/create scarce goods. -9:14 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans #filmin140 The real challenge is how to leverage #inf goods in a scallable way. As an independent. With little money often. -9:15 PM Sep 29th, 2010

joda07 Hey fellow filmmakers, interesting panel on current issues facing film Eg: piracy. On now! Search: #filmin140 #film #scriptwriting -9:15 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel Is piracy, for a film, a good problem to have? Doesn’t that mean there’s an interested audience out there? #filmin140 -9:16 PM Sep 29th, 2010

IndstryStdFilms RT @Filmin140Panel: Welcome to the first Film in 140 Twitter Panel! Our topic tonight is “Film Piracy: Does It Help or Hurt?” #filmin140 -9:16 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans #filmin140 I think micropayments for increments of a film will be the biggest rev stream. -9:17 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans #filmin140 But that incremental micropayment model would have to be done in a way that’s not disruptive to the viewing experience. -9:17 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms We’ve found more than 25,000 streams/downloads so there’s interest…but when you can watch it free online, it hurts legit sales #filmin140 -9:17 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms #filmin140 You can watch our film online, in full. http://twitpic.com/2t7ib0 -9:19 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans #filmin140 Piracy is a great problem if you’ve anticipated and planned for it. -9:20 PM Sep 29th, 2010

dennispeters If ur film is pirated & not viewed how does it effect the value? RT @Filmin140Panel Is piracy for a film a good problem to have? #filmin140 -9:20 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel @jnathanevans so you’re suggesting an almost pay for the minute model? Did that work for porn? #filmin140 -9:20 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel @fastgirlfilms do you think those 25K would’ve known about your film had it not been bootlegged? #filmin140 -9:20 PM Sep 29th, 2010

KageyNYC I don’t download illegally, not b/c I’m so righteous but b/c I’m lazy. I like stream to TV, higher-quality & can watch big screen #filmin140 -9:20 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 But how do filmmakers collect $? RT @jnathanevans: #filmin140 I think micropayments for increments of a film will be the biggest rev stream. -9:21 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans #filmin140 I would even consider preemptively releasing a version to pirate sites with my film’s URL burned at the bottom of the screen. -9:21 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel @jnathanevans what about just offering an official free torrent as well as paid options. Like NIN or Radiohead did with music? #filmin140 -9:22 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms No, but that’s beside the point. Sales to our audience (LGBT) have been lost. #filmin140 -9:23 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 RT @KageyNYC: I don’t download illegally, not b/c I’m so righteous but b/c I’m lazy. I like stream to TV, higher-quality & can watch big screen #filmin140 -9:23 PM Sep 29th, 2010

gismotigga RT @fastgirlfilms: We’ve found more than 25,000 streams/downloads so there’s interest…but when you can watch it free online, it hurts legit sales #filmin140 -9:24 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans #filmin140 Re: micropayments, this is anticipating a broadly adopted, portable platform. Facebook by my predictions. -9:24 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel @fastgirlfilms have you calculated a figure as far as lost sales? How did you come to that figure? #filmin140 -9:24 PM Sep 29th, 2010

TiffanyDEmidio RT @fastgirlfilms: #filmin140 You can watch our film online, in full. http://twitpic.com/2t7ib0 -9:24 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler @fastgirlfilms why have the sales been lost? the film is still available right? not all LGBT audience torrent #filmin140 -9:24 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms Our website URL is #1 in Google search so folks know where to find the film if they want. Links to various options to view/buy. #filmin140 -9:24 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans #filmin140 I think that the pay per minute model is still about 2 years ahead of its time though, pending several dominant platforms. -9:25 PM Sep 29th, 2010

milesmaker Consider piracy a form of flattery, then consider its impact on ROI in your biz plan. Some genres are pirated more than others! #filmin140 -9:25 PM Sep 29th, 2010

TiffanyDEmidio RT @fastgirlfilms: We’ve found more than 25,000 streams/downloads so there’s interest…but when you can watch it free online, it hurts legit sales #filmin140 -9:25 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel From @atlfilm365 – @fastgirlfilms for “Then Came Lola”, do you feel having a built in audience increases the damage of piracy? #filmin140 -9:25 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms @shericandler Torrents are not where it’s at. Online streams of the film are really the issue. #filmin140 -9:26 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms Yes, because the LGBT audience is anxious to see the few films that represent them. Online is immediate gratification. #filmin140 -9:27 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 RT @fastgirlfilms: Yes, because the LGBT audience is anxious to see the few films that represent them. Online is immediate gratification. #filmin140 -9:27 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler @fastgirlfilms would you say you are deeply in touch with your audience or do they feel they are stealing from a faceless entity? #filmin140 -9:28 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel From @atlfilm365 – @jnathanevans Are there films out now you would have personally made micro payments for? #filmin140 -9:28 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jeannevb psst #scriptchat #filmmakers the new chat #filmin140 is on NOW talking piracy… jump in http://tinyurl.com/2g8hbhq -9:28 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler @Filmin140Panel @jnathanevans I watched INK on iTunes and paid because I heard from the filmmakers and the buzz from the torrent #filmin140 -9:30 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans #filmin140 @atlfilms I would have paid micropayments to see all of Dr Horrible at once. -9:30 PM Sep 29th, 2010

KageyNYC Seems many pirated films r viewed not b/c viewer was so enamored but b/c it was free. Is this really the same audience for sales? #filmin140 -9:30 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms @shericandler I think part of it’s education-LGBT grumble not enough film 4 them, yet undermine it when it’s made, not thinking #filmin140 -9:30 PM Sep 29th, 2010

FuriousDShow RT @KageyNYC: Seems many pirated films r viewed not b/c viewer was so enamored but b/c it was free. Is this really the same audience for sales? #filmin140 -9:31 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms Well DVD sales are history so it’s VOD. When it’s easy to DL or watch free, why do iTunes or Amazon or Netflix even. #filmin140 -9:31 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 RT @KageyNYC: Seems many pirated films r viewed not b/c viewer was so enamored but b/c it was free. Is this really the same audience for sales? #filmin140 -9:31 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler @fastgirlfilms how did they hear about the film? From contact from you, press, organic search? #filmin140 -9:32 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 @KageyNYC It’s a good question. But so far statistics say the most pirated movies are the most seen in theaters. #filmin140 -9:32 PM Sep 29th, 2010

dennispeters key point RT @KageyNYC …films r viewed not b/c viewer was so enamored but b/c it was free. Is this same audience for sales? #filmin140 -9:32 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms We’ve done tons of Social Media, web, etc. well before release. 100 festivals around the world, etc….so word is out. #filmin140 -9:33 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans #filmin140 @KageyNYC I disagree on that. I would only seek out a film I knew and knew was good. -9:34 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms Most Indie filmmakers don’t have theatrical releases so depend on sales to earn anything. #filmin140 -9:34 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel @fastgirlfilms In policing piracy, do you go after the streaming sites, the downloaders or both? #filmin140 -9:34 PM Sep 29th, 2010

KageyNYC @atlfilm365 They also tend to have the best marketing & instill the greatest curiosity factor. Not to play devil’s advocate… 😉 #filmin140 -9:34 PM Sep 29th, 2010

TheLoneOlive RT @jeannevb: psst #scriptchat #filmmakers the new chat #filmin140 is on NOW talking piracy… jump in http://tinyurl.com/2g8hbhq -9:35 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms We go after both via DMCA. Most respond eventually, but then another takes it’s place immediately. Whack-a-mole. #filmin140 -9:35 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 RT @KageyNYC: @atlfilm365 They also tend to have the best marketing & instill the greatest curiosity factor. Not to play devil’s advocate… 😉 #filmin140 -9:35 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler @fastgirlfilms how did the copies get online? from a physical copy? did you release while on the circuit? #filmin140 -9:35 PM Sep 29th, 2010

gismotigga RT @fastgirlfilms: Well DVD sales are history so it’s VOD. When it’s easy to DL or watch free, why do iTunes or Amazon or Netflix even. #filmin140 -9:35 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms Also send DMCAs to Google AdSense since there ads appear nearly everywhere on pirate sites. #filmin140 -9:36 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 @KageyNYC You bring up a great point. What does that say/do for an indie film with no marketing budget that is widely pirated? #filmin140 -9:36 PM Sep 29th, 2010

KageyNYC @jnathanevans Totally personal, not pro POV, but only film I ever watched illegally was Hostel, curious, never would have bought #filmin140 -9:36 PM Sep 29th, 2010

gismotigga RT @fastgirlfilms: Most Indie filmmakers don’t have theatrical releases so depend on sales to earn anything. #filmin140 -9:36 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms @shericandler Within 24 hrs of German DVD release, it was online. Blu-ray release, it really took off. #filmin140 -9:37 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans #filmin140 Agreed with @atlfilm365 that marketing is huge. On some level, someone has to know something about your film to start with. -9:37 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler the thing I don’t like about what you have suggested is legislation on websites deemed undesirable. That’s a slippery slope to me #filmin140 -9:37 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel @atlfilm365 Are there widely pirated films that no one has heard of? #filmin140 -9:37 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel If you make a film, and no one sees it, did you make a film? #filmin140 -9:37 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms It’s easy to determine websites that operate only to pirate films. They feature films and ads and nothing more. #filmin140 -9:38 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel @fastgirlfilms so the german distributor dropped the ball in protecting the film from piracy? #filmin140 -9:38 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms @Filmin140Panel Not at all. The DVD was “protected’…took tens seconds to rip… #filmin140 -9:39 PM Sep 29th, 2010

KageyNYC @atlfilm365 I hope that means they created tremendous interest in the film, thru other means, & ppl are curious to see more. #filmin140 -9:39 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler @fastgirlfilms but when it is ok to take down any site for whatever reason, that opens up a door I don’t want to see opened #filmin140 -9:39 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel I can’t imagine watching anything on a sketchy streaming website. Forget piracy, what about computer viruses? #filmin140 -9:39 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms Copy-protection is meaningless. Some people like to be the first to “rip” a DVD and post online…kind of a race for them #filmin140 -9:39 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans #filmin140 @KageyNYC Interesting, and agreed that I probably never would have bought it either 🙂 -9:40 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms @Filmin140Panel I wish they were sketchy…you can see films in HD glory online without a glitch (or virus) no problem. #filmin140 -9:40 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler legislation to crackdown on content deemed undesirable can spread to all kinds of censorship. Not ok to me. to protect u #filmin140 -9:40 PM Sep 29th, 2010

gismotigga RT @fastgirlfilms: Copy-protection is meaningless. Some people like to be the first to “rip” a DVD and post online…kind of a race for them #filmin140 -9:41 PM Sep 29th, 2010

broken_baja RT @fastgirlfilms: Well, learn the “media” game? Our film is available legally online in various ways but hard to compete with “free” #filmin140 -9:41 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel For indie films, is there really such a competition for pirated copies? It feels like a problem for good, well-marketed films. #filmin140 -9:41 PM Sep 29th, 2010

broken_baja RT @fastgirlfilms: Copy-protection is meaningless. Some people like to be the first to “rip” a DVD and post online…kind of a race for them #filmin140 -9:41 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms #filmin140 Here’s a page from a Chinese search with one page of results for streams of our film http://twitpic.com/2t7p0g -9:42 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 W/ so many indie films made, it’s a good question RT @Filmin140Panel: If you make a film, & no one sees it, did you make a film? #filmin140 -9:42 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Chuklz What I have learned recently is that people don’t buy “what we make”, they buy “why we make” #filmin140 -9:42 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms @Filmin140Panel I can’t speak for all indie films, but I have seen what’s unfolded with ours. #filmin140 -9:42 PM Sep 29th, 2010

KageyNYC I don’t buy movies I haven’t seen. I may not be audience ur discussing but I see then *maybe* buy, viewing doesn’t hurt purchase #filmin140 -9:42 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler awesome insight RT @Chuklz: What I have learned recently is that people dont buy “what we make”, they buy “why we make” #filmin140 -9:43 PM Sep 29th, 2010

dennispeters can’t stop them. need to find a way to leverage the exposure RT @fastgirlfilms @Filmin140Panel I wish they were sketchy… #filmin140 -9:43 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms For me, I really get frustrated that companies like Google make money from pirated films and PAY money to those who pirate them. #filmin140 -9:43 PM Sep 29th, 2010

productionkat RT @dennispeters: If ur film is pirated & not viewed how does it effect the value? RT @Filmin140Panel Is piracy for a film a good problem to have? #filmin140 -9:44 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel What if we take the view that piracy is not going away; you can’t stop them all: can a filmmaker take advantage of piracy? #filmin140 -9:44 PM Sep 29th, 2010

dennispeters It would be interesting to see stats on piracy demographics #filmin140 -9:44 PM Sep 29th, 2010

SharkGoddess It’s sad that so many don’t realize how many people behind the scenes they’e hurting when they steal movies. #filmin140 #filmin140 -9:45 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel @fastgirlfilms Losing revenue and then watching those behind said loss profit from it does add insult to injury. #filmin140 -9:45 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms That’s why I began my blog: www.popuppirates.com If you did away with profit motive in piracy many websites wldn’t exist. #filmin140 -9:45 PM Sep 29th, 2010

SharkGoddess @dennispeters Yes, it would indeed be nice to see a breakdown of who is stealing them. #filmin140 -9:45 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans #filmin140 I bet this would be a different conversation if hard copies & downloads weren’t released and only pay per stream was an option. -9:45 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler I understand you frustration but I can’t abide censorship in any way, too dangerousr. Find another way to make money frm content #filmin140 -9:45 PM Sep 29th, 2010

dennispeters @fastgirlfilms yes google seems to make out ok on the piracy end of things #filmin140 -9:46 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel @dennispeters I doubt that could happen, as if you had the demos, you’d know who to take down. #filmin140 -9:46 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Chuklz The most compelling part of #INK for me was @DoubleEdgeFilms story of how they got it done. #filmin140 -9:46 PM Sep 29th, 2010

KageyNYC So much VHS/DVD buying came from newness of actually owning films. That idea is gone, you don’t have to own, so what’s new model? #filmin140 -9:46 PM Sep 29th, 2010

SharkGoddess @jnathanevans Interesting idea. #filmin140 -9:46 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans #filmin140 Though it’s doable, it’s a lot harder to make a quality pirated copy of a stream. -9:46 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms @shericandler How is it “censorship” to prevent websites from streaming stolen films? #filmin140 -9:47 PM Sep 29th, 2010

MJ_Slide RT @Chuklz: What I have learned recently is that people don’t buy “what we make”, they buy “why we make” #filmin140 -9:47 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel @jnathanevans but even that is open to hacking, yeah. Piracy isn’t going anywhere. #filmin140 -9:47 PM Sep 29th, 2010

screenwindow @KageyNYC True, people don’t buy movies they haven’t seen. The question is why buy it if you can see it AGAIN for free infinitely #filmin140 -9:47 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms It’s not about free speech, it’s about theft. That’s a very different issue. I’m all for free speech… #filmin140 -9:48 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler @fastgirlfilms because your are asking to prevent a website from existence. First to “protect” you and then to protect anyone #filmin140 -9:48 PM Sep 29th, 2010

SharkGoddess Pirating is the same as shoplifting them from the shelf. So pirating is for those to chicken**** to go 2 the store & shoplift it. #filmin140 -9:48 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms @jnathanevans Well, often the sites that stream conveniently offer a download version too… #filmin140 -9:48 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler @fastgirlfilms protect the government, protect christian values, to protect whatever we say needs protecting. #filmin140 -9:48 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 RT @SharkGoddess: Pirating is the same as shoplifting them from the shelf. So pirating is for those to chicken**** to go 2 the store & shoplift it. #filmin140 -9:49 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel RT @screenwindow people don’t buy movies they haven’t seen. The question is why buy it if you can see it AGAIN 4 free infinitely #filmin140 -9:49 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans #filmin140 I would personally strike first by releasing a limited content copy (say 50 minutes of 70 or 80), adding my URL burned on image. -9:49 PM Sep 29th, 2010

lmcnelly RT @MJ_Slide: RT @Chuklz: What I have learned recently is that people don’t buy “what we make”, they buy “why we make” #filmin140 -9:49 PM Sep 29th, 2010

KageyNYC @screenwindow I’d like to see it again, as part of a subscription, infinitely. Feel free to tell me I’m part of the problem. 😉 #filmin140 -9:49 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms @shericandler How is protecting film online any different than saying folks can’t steal the DVD from Target? #filmin140 -9:49 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler @SharkGoddess no that’s wrong. It isn’t theft because it is being reproduced. You still have it, just suffer lesser gain #filmin140 -9:49 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Chuklz Everything is vulnerable at the point of transmission. Connecting with the audience directly is possibly part of the answer. #filmin140 -9:50 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans #filmin140 Then make it super easy and cheap to buy the full version from the landing page (custom URL for the pirated copy). -9:50 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms @shericandler I couldn’t print Ansel Adams photos and open up a store and sell them. How’s that different? #filmin140 -9:50 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 RT @jnathanevans: #filmin140 I would personally strike first by releasing a limited content copy (say 50 minutes of 70 or 80), adding my URL burned on image. -9:51 PM Sep 29th, 2010

TopDawgMusic RT @MJ_Slide: RT @Chuklz: What I have learned recently is that people don’t buy “what we make”, they buy “why we make” #filmin140 -9:51 PM Sep 29th, 2010

SharkGoddess @shericandler Respectfully, it is stealing. It’s it gotten illegally on the net & not paid for it’s theft, stealing. #filmin140 -9:51 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel Is it possible to cultivate your illegal download audience for the future films? #filmin140 -9:51 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Chuklz @fastgirlfilms You can copy the photos and hang them on your wall until the estate came over for coffee #filmin140 -9:52 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel I see that @jnathanevans is answering that question already… #filmin140 -9:52 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler @fastgirlfilms of course you could,but opening a physical shop probably not best idea. #filmin140 -9:52 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms @Filmin140Panel I think film delivery methods will adapt and evolve of course. #filmin140 -9:52 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans #filmin140 A custom URL for each pirate site would help you gauge traffic, stats, etc. -9:52 PM Sep 29th, 2010

dennispeters @Filmin140Panel the demos are there. the music biz has already gone thru this. Lots of people went down then. didn’t stop it tho. #filmin140 -9:52 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel @shericandler that’s the issue tho: the websites are operating as “stores,” as they’re making money from ads #filmin140 -9:53 PM Sep 29th, 2010

screenwindow @KageyNYC if you love watching good movies, you’re part of the solution. Finding an audience is the hard part. #filmin140 -9:53 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jeannevb I love how #filmin140 jumps into chatland w a simple, easy-to-agree-with topic like piracy 🙂 #nowussychat -9:53 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler @SharkGoddess no respectfully, they are not depriving you of your content you still have it. They just have a copy #filmin140 -9:53 PM Sep 29th, 2010

SharkGoddess @Filmin140Panel Not sure if that’s good idea.It encourages pirating in that case, wouldn’t it? That would also be rewarding them #filmin140 -9:53 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms I also think it’s important to look at WHO makes a film and how they are impacted. All the crew, actors, artists, etc. #filmin140 -9:53 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler @Filmin140Panel so what would happen if you gave them the copies, good ones and made them affiliates to get a cut? #filmin140 -9:54 PM Sep 29th, 2010

SharkGoddess @shericandler They’re taking it off the net when they should be buying it from the shelf or through legal means. It’s not paid 4 #filmin140 -9:54 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms @shericandler So if you can “copy” something, it’s free to take and sell? #filmin140 -9:55 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans #filmin140 @fastgirlfilms Agreed on the WHO makes the film point, even producers forget that aspect often… -9:55 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Chuklz People make movies because they love to make movies. If money were motive, we’d all be bankers. #filmin140 -9:55 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel @SharkGoddess I’m talking about in an inperfect world where piracy never disappears; there has to be a way to benefit #filmin140 -9:55 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler @fastgirlfilms audience in generl don’t care about you. Unless you make them. It is all about them. Serve them, mk it easy #filmin140 -9:56 PM Sep 29th, 2010

SharkGoddess @shericandler Again, respectuflly, I believe that constitutes theft. So, I’m not sure what you’re referring to #filmin140 -9:56 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms @Chuklz We’re not trying to “make money” at this point, just pay off debts from “making” :-)) #filmin140 -9:56 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jbrotherlove if you’re interested in the creation/marketing of indie film (or any discipline), #filmin140 is a good hashtag to follow right now. -9:56 PM Sep 29th, 2010

dennispeters It’s free just not legal RT @fastgirlfilms @shericandler So if you can “copy” something, it’s free to take and sell? #filmin140 -9:56 PM Sep 29th, 2010

milesmaker Piracy is a culture among tech savvy gamers. Action, sex & violent movies are targeted so redirect anger with counter-strategies. #filmin140 -9:57 PM Sep 29th, 2010

KageyNYC Does viewer really want 2 buy indiv films or buy into system that streams everything? Isn’t q about negotiating rights to stream? #filmin140 -9:57 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler @fastgirlfilms like it or not, yes, now it can be done and little you can do to stop it #filmin140 -9:57 PM Sep 29th, 2010

SharkGoddess @Filmin140Panel Yes, of course, I’m approaching from the morals side, when it needs an all around approach,as u suggested.My bad #filmin140 -9:57 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms @shericandler Well, we have served them by making a film. #filmin140 -9:57 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Chuklz @fastgirlfilms When Sheri posted that on her FB page, it really resonated with me. #filmin140 -9:57 PM Sep 29th, 2010

SharkGoddess IMO, the public does need to be made aware they’re not just hurting the actors, but everyone that has something to do w/ it.Pt 1 #filmin140 -9:59 PM Sep 29th, 2010

MJ_Slide Right again! RT @Chuklz: People make movies because they love to make movies. If money were motive, we’d all be bankers. #filmin140 -9:59 PM Sep 29th, 2010

SharkGoddess Maybe more awareness could lessen the bleeding of it Pt 2 #filmin140 -9:59 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 RT @milesmaker: Piracy is a culture among tech savvy gamers. Action, sex & violent movies are targeted so redirect anger with counter-strategies. #filmin140 -9:59 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler @fastgirlfilms no that’s just an entitlement you feel. You made it because you wanted to, they feel nothing for you. #filmin140 -9:59 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms You have different levels of piracy. What’s pushing it now is the profit motive. Money is being made, just not 4 creators. #filmin140 -10:00 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel That was a fast hour! The conversation doesn’t need to stop, but I want to thank the panelists for joining us tonight! #filmin140 -10:00 PM Sep 29th, 2010

SharkGoddess Thank you everyone. #filmin140 -10:01 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Filmin140Panel Again, keep using the hashtag and discussing film piracy, and the transcript will be available later on at FilmThreat.com. #filmin140 -10:01 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms @shericandler OK, I guess I feel “entitled” not to have our film stolen, posted, and earn money for Google. ;-)) #filmin140 -10:01 PM Sep 29th, 2010

SharkGoddess @shericandler Thank you for sharing your thoughts. 🙂 #filmin140 -10:01 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms Thank you for inviting me! #filmin140 -10:01 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jbrotherlove RT @Filmin140Panel: If you make a film, and no one sees it, did you make a film? #filmin140 -10:01 PM Sep 29th, 2010

thesarahevans People are disillusioned to think that downloading the film will help the filmmakers in some way. For most it doesn’t help at all #filmin140 -10:01 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Chuklz AmazoniTunesHulu&Netflix prove ppl are willing to pay for content.The content featured is identical to what is pirated. Thoughts? #filmin140 -10:01 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms @Chuklz Our film is on Amazon iTunes, and Netflix but hard to compete with free. #filmin140 -10:03 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler man that was fast! my point, think about making an engaged community around yourselves b4 you make anything. #filmin140 -10:03 PM Sep 29th, 2010

KageyNYC Wow, that was fast…& intense! I like healthy sparring b/c we’re on same side but pushing from dif POVs for new model. Nice work #filmin140 -10:03 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler it is harder to steal from a friend than it is from a total stranger #filmin140 -10:03 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms @shericandler I think we did and the reception to our film shows that. #filmin140 -10:03 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 @fastgirlfilms @jnathanevans Thanks for participating in our first #filmin140! -10:03 PM Sep 29th, 2010

thesarahevans Disillusioned people think that downloading the film will help the filmmakers in some way but for most it doesn’t help at all. #filmin140 -10:04 PM Sep 29th, 2010

jnathanevans Thanks for @shericandler @Filmin140Panel @fastgirlfilms and all out there following for a great #filmin140 discussion! -10:04 PM Sep 29th, 2010

lmcnelly True. More reason to interact w/ audience RT @shericandler: it is harder to steal from a friend than it is from a total stranger #filmin140 -10:04 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler @fastgirlfilms but they didn’t feel that connection. Or they didn’t think the film was worth paying for #filmin140 -10:04 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 RT @thesarahevans: Disillusioned people think that downloading the film will help the filmmakers in some way but for most it doesn’t help at all. #filmin140 -10:04 PM Sep 29th, 2010

CriticalTodd RT @MJ_Slide: Right again! RT @Chuklz: People make movies because they love to make movies. If money were motive, we’d all be bankers. #filmin140 -10:05 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms @shericandler #filmin140 -10:05 PM Sep 29th, 2010

fastgirlfilms @shericandler I think it’s a mindset…I see it among my students. Even if they like something, they don’t pay 4 it… #filmin140 -10:05 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler big thanks to Ellen and Nathan for taking time with us #filmin140 -10:06 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 @thesarahevans It’s a ? of how you define help. For films like MAN FROM EARTH they embraced piracy bc it increased awareness. #filmin140 -10:06 PM Sep 29th, 2010

AZFilmFest Missed the kick *ss @Filmin140Panel discussion on film piracy? Check FilmThreat.com for transcript later #filmin140 #greatstuff! -10:06 PM Sep 29th, 2010

missalfreddrive I’m surprised by the number of people I follow referencing #filmin140 . I think I may have to check out the ‘hullabalu.’ 🙂 -10:06 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Chuklz Thank you @shericandler, the panel and fellow participants! #filmin140 -10:07 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler @missalfreddrive hullabalu will b archived on the Film Threat site tomorrow #filmin140 -10:08 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 RT @missalfreddrive: I’m surprised by the number of people I follow referencing #filmin140 . I think I may have to check out the ‘hullabalu.’ 🙂 -10:08 PM Sep 29th, 2010

JWalkerscene Explains my lack of… RT @Chuklz People make movies because they love to make movies. If money were motive, we’d all be bankers. #filmin140 -10:09 PM Sep 29th, 2010

mrbarnard1 #filmin140 Our product is INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY. DVD, film, files just packages that deliver the IP. Issue: loss of control of *IP* by theft -10:09 PM Sep 29th, 2010

AFather_And_Son #filmin140 Our product is INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY. DVD, film, files just packages that deliver the IP. Issue: loss of control of *IP* by theft -10:09 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler regarding payment, make it cheap and easy to get your film. Not $17.99 like in that LA Times article, crazy price 4 indie DVD #filmin140 -10:09 PM Sep 29th, 2010

FilmThreat That was fun! Let’s do it again in two weeks! Remember 2 follow @Filmin140Panel & we’ll have updates here & at FilmThreat.com #filmin140 -10:10 PM Sep 29th, 2010

Chuklz RT @shericandler: regarding payment, make it cheap and easy to get your film. Not $17.99 like in that LA Times article, crazy price 4 indie DVD #filmin140 -10:10 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 RT @mrbarnard1: #filmin140 Our product is INTELLECTUAL PROPERTY. DVD, film, files just packages that deliver the IP. Issue: loss of control of *IP* by theft -10:10 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 RT @FilmThreat: That was fun! Let’s do it again in two weeks! Remember 2 follow @Filmin140Panel & we’ll have updates here & at FilmThreat.com #filmin140 -10:11 PM Sep 29th, 2010

lmcnelly Wait, not 4 groupies? RT @Chuklz: People make movies because they love to make movies. If money were motive, we’d all be bankers. #filmin140 -10:11 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 @mrbarnard1 So do you feel the definition of intellectual property is too tied to packaging in consumer minds? #filmin140 -10:12 PM Sep 29th, 2010

shericandler I’m off everyone, Starbucks kicking me out. See you in the Twitterverse #filmin140 -10:12 PM Sep 29th, 2010

PaulMakesMovies RT @FilmThreat: That was fun! Let’s do it again in two weeks! Remember 2 follow @Filmin140Panel & we’ll have updates here & at FilmThreat.com #filmin140 -10:13 PM Sep 29th, 2010

mrbarnard1 @atlfilm365 It IS theft. Did they have permission to take the IP? That’s common law throughout history of creative effort. IMHO #filmin140 -10:14 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 RT @mrbarnard1: @atlfilm365 It IS theft. Did they have permission to take the IP? That’s common law throughout history of creative effort. IMHO #filmin140 -10:15 PM Sep 29th, 2010

DoubleNW @jeannevb I popped n #filmin140… It was a very good topic! -10:15 PM Sep 29th, 2010

thesarahevans @atlfilm365 That’s why I said most. I’m no expert and just a fan of film but it seems to me pirating blockbuster films doesn’t… #filmin140 -10:17 PM Sep 29th, 2010

thesarahevans @atlfilm365 have the same effect as it does on indie films in terms of $. If a filmmaker can find the benefit I say go for it. #filmin140 -10:20 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 @mrbarnard1 It’s a common law, but true digital distribution is less than 20 years old. Not sure the public sees at as clearly. #filmin140 -10:23 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 @mrbarnard1 Nearly all of us learn at an early age that stealing is wrong because someone sees us and says something. #filmin140 -10:24 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 @mrbarnard1 With digital distribution, it’s possible to take and not get caught. By your parents, by the law. #filmin140 -10:24 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 @mrbarnard1 As such, I think it changes how we talk about (and interact with) intellectual property. #filmin140 -10:25 PM Sep 29th, 2010

mrbarnard1 @atlfilm365 Everyone I’ve discussed it with said, “I know I *should’ve* paid for it…” Contrived justifications exist. #filmin140 -10:25 PM Sep 29th, 2010

WaterholeMovie RT @lmcnelly: True. More reason to interact w/ audience RT @shericandler: it is harder to steal from a friend than it is from a total stranger #filmin140 -10:27 PM Sep 29th, 2010

mrbarnard1 @atlfilm365 Yes, we go from NO consequence to suing for $$MILLIONS. That’s wrong, there needs to be a *reasonable* response. #filmin140 -10:28 PM Sep 29th, 2010

thesarahevans @atlfilm365 I’d love to see a list of films that embraced piracy in some form to have their film be [in their terms] successful #filmin140 -10:29 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 @mrbarnard1 Define everyone? I’m 37, so I know everyone around my age thinks piracy is wrong, even if they do it. #filmin140 -10:31 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 @mrbarnard1 But for younger people coming up and for countries that have never had strong IP laws, I think the convo changes. #filmin140 -10:31 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 RT @mrbarnard1: @atlfilm365 Yes, we go from NO consequence to suing for $$MILLIONS. That’s wrong, there needs to be a *reasonable* response. #filmin140 -10:32 PM Sep 29th, 2010

lmcnelly @mrbarnard1 tell them: I’m ok w/ you stealing my film if I can have crew members sleep at your house during my next production #filmin140 -10:32 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 RT @thesarahevans: @atlfilm365 I’d love to see a list of films that embraced piracy in some form to have their film be [in their terms] successful #filmin140 -10:33 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 RT @lmcnelly: @mrbarnard1 tell them: I’m ok w/ you stealing my film if I can have crew members sleep at your house during my next production #filmin140 -10:34 PM Sep 29th, 2010

thesarahevans @mrbarnard1 People need to realize that it is stealing and there are actual consequences. Amount of lawsuits might help that #filmin140 -10:34 PM Sep 29th, 2010

thesarahevans @atlfilm365 @mrbarnard1 Laws have always been behind the advancement and the uses of technology. Pirating, online bullying, etc #filmin140 -10:37 PM Sep 29th, 2010

LLCooLil rt@Chuklz: What I have learned recently is that people dont buy “what we make”, they buy “why we make” #filmin140 -10:40 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 RT @thesarahevans: @atlfilm365 @mrbarnard1 Laws have always been behind the advancement and the uses of technology. Pirating, online bullying, etc #filmin140 -10:44 PM Sep 29th, 2010

atlfilm365 Okay, quitting #filmin140 for the night. Another one in two weeks. Follow at @Filmin140Panel, @shericandler & @FilmThreat! -10:47 PM Sep 29th, 2010

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