From a feminist perspective, do you think that the judgment of child-free women has to do with–I hate even saying this, but–the patriarchy, or society at large wanting to keep us occupied so that we won’t try to make changes to the system?
I probably didn’t think that a few years ago when we had a different administration. I do feel that in the past a lot of the research had been done by men. I think women are becoming louder and more vocal and more engaged in the research. They are in positions such as doctors, gynecologists, etc, we are getting a different voice coming through. I’m still surprised this is the first film on the subject. It’s amazing to see the books out there now which has grown in the last six years of me making the film, even. So as one woman, who you’ve seen in the film, as she said, she would hide the fact she didn’t want kids. She would just let people think she couldn’t have them, which I just think is heartbreaking because you’re not speaking your truth. Younger women are definitely becoming much more vocal about it, and I would like to believe that things are changing as we get more women in different positions.
I’m a big member of the subreddit r/childfree, which has a huge audience, which is just so exciting for me because they’re desperate for this film. In there, some people will say they had a male gynecologist and had an experience that was the same as when they saw a woman gynecologist. So I think it’s just educating people that one in four women will not have children. Now I’ve just spoken to a woman who actually has a book out that takes people through the steps of making the decision (to be child-free). She was invited to speak at a conference for gynecologists so that kind of thing makes you believe things are changing. We’re getting more and more invites in those areas as well, which is really exciting because it’s getting to people who are actually going to treat, whether it be a therapist or a gynecologist. Just so they know and understand that this is another option for people and not just women. You know, tons of men aren’t wanting kids but that’s so much more acceptable.
“…it’s just educating people that one in four women will not have children.”
I found it really interesting when you went to the child-free meetup in Brooklyn and the men seemed incredibly nonchalant about their choices to not have children. How do you feel about that?
That’s why again it’s been great to see how many men are involved in the childfree subreddit and the men that I’ve interviewed have been a mixed bag. Some men are pressured by their families as well, even if they’re in a partnership. Some gay couples are told that they’re not a real family unless they have a child. So, I don’t think they’re free from the stigma at all. I think the topic of conversation doesn’t come up that often, at the workplace for sure. There’s actually quite a bit of research about having a child can affect a woman in the workplace, as well as not having a child. Actually, sometimes, for men, it seems to affect them for the better in the workplace which is certainly not true for women.
There are a couple of scenes in To Kid or Not To Kid that show you looking at Facebook comments on posts that discuss being child-free, and some of them were crazy. Have you ever had any harsh criticism lobbed at you personally?
I have since I’ve started being more vocal on the subject. This was a process for me. So it was a huge shock to see how many people had been trolled. The subreddit group is trolled regularly. One of the guests that we have at the New York theatrical opening is called Leilani Munter and she’s just retired from race car driving. She was a very famous female race car driver and she made a statement recently about being child-free and she was told to kill herself. It’s ridiculous. As if there aren’t enough things in the world to rail against. That definitely is one thing to be up there, right?
Right! So you told me you teach documentary filmmaking. Have any of your students seen the film and if so what do they think about it?
They have and it’s been a wonderful response, actually. One guy turned around to me and said, “I want my wife to see this because she wants another child and I don’t.” I was like, “That’s brilliant.” That’s exactly what this film is for, it’s for people on their own road. There’s plenty of people who are happily child-free but this is a way to kind of say “Listen, if you don’t accept my decision, let’s watch this film and then chat.” When I did my Kickstarter campaign a few years ago, I actually offered an anonymous link as a reward. I said “Give me the email address of the person who’s being hostile towards you, whether it’s a colleague, whether it’s a friend or family member. I can just send an email link of the film when it comes out and they don’t even need to know it’s come from you if that happens.”
